Is anyone surprised that the absurd quarterback situation bit the Vikings today, resulting in a 20-17 overtime loss to the Lions?
There are precious few positions that are absolutely crucial in team sports. But quarterback ranks with hockey goalie and starting pitcher as a spot where a markedly subpar performance almost always dooms your ballclub. Surely coach Brad Childress knows this, so he is either arrogant enough to believe he can do with Tavaris Jackson what the Eagles did with Donovan McNabb, stupid enough to believe he won't get fired if he turns last year's 6-10 into the same or worse this season, or he has the word of the owner that he has at least another year after this one--and believes it. Which, again, makes him either very arrogant or very stupid.
Jackson seems like a good dude, and admirably accepted the heat for a terrible, terrible performance today. But that's really about the only positive thing you can say about him right now. All four of his interceptions were cringe-inducing, not a single one tipped by a defender or bouncing in or off a receiver. Instead, they revealed a lack of judgment, a lack of touch, and a lack of self-possession in more ways than one. It is really difficult to imagine this guy approaching the caretaker status of a Trent Dilfer, let alone someone who can win you ballgames on his own. I know it takes time to learn, and young QBs inevitably look shaky, but c'mon, last week's ugly squeaker over Atlanta is the current highpoint of his career, which is exactly what you'd expect from a guy whose best attribute was being a stud athlete, and who didn't even play major college football.
So far almost everything is going according to form with these Vikings. Most of their supposed strengths are indeed strong, but not nearly strong enough to overcome their obviously crippling weaknesses. I don't pretend to follow the game as closely as I do pro hoops, or even baseball, but I have seen seven of their eight and half quarters thus far this season (including today's entire contest) and am myself arrogant or stupid enough to spout off about my impressions.
**Adrian Peterson was even more impressive this week than on opening day. Yeah, I know his numbers were mediocre at best, but Peterson bounced off the first guy to hit him at least eight times today, and bounced off multiple people at least three or four, including that beautiful run--a mix of grit, lateral threading and that glorious speed of his--to set up Jackson's arm-stretched running TD for the only six by the Vikes' offense. At least ten times he picked up substantially more yardage than an average back would have garnered. One of his first carries of the day, an off tackle play to the left, wasn't there for him and his jag to the sideline seemed to be accomplished simultanously with his upfield explosion. It was probably only about a 6, 7 yard run, but it was the kind of play that scares the shit out of defensive coordinators on tape and gets linebackers and defensive ends warned to prioritize the "outside contain," which is why it would be fun to either throw Chester Taylor (when healthy) back there with Peterson or give the ball to Tony Richardson (when healthy) up the gut more often. The plays with my man (I may be his last staunch supporter, but I love the guy) Mewelde Moore and Peterson sharing a backfield were likewise very successful today.
One last thing about Peterson; you hear all this stuff about how he runs too high, doesn't get low enough. I'll concede that this might increase his risk of injury, but otherwise, man, it's part of his style, and everyone should leave him alone about it. A lot of fabulous backs ran high in their day, including Walter Payton, Christian Okoye and to a lesser extent Emmitt Smith. Besides, Peterson plays off that high style, in that he often lowers his shoulder and rises up to shrug off tacklers--that's one of the reasons they bounce off him. Watching him, you can certainly understand why his collarbone is injury-prone, and people coming at him sidewise really can measure him for a monster hit. But like all great backs, so much of what he is doing is intuitive and can't really be changed without sacrificing something good. Leave him alone and cross your fingers. And notice right now that it is Taylor and Richardson who are dinged, not AP.
** About the only thing that has really surprised me about the Vikes this season surprised me about them last year too, but I foolishly bought the hype again over the off-season: Their offensive line is way overrated. The right side was going to be shakey from the start, but the fabled left side, the expensive, star-studded trio of McKinnie-Hutchinson-Birk, simply aren't as good as their reputations. Shaun Rogers had a whale of a day at the nose tackle over Birk, and Corey Redding likewise was often in the backfield. There were precious few gaping holes for Peterson and co. to run through, and precious few occasions when Jackson could drop back in the pocket and casually survey the field. Those three stud linemen, plus Peterson, pretty much comprise the Vikings' only hope for offensive success this season, and the beef isn't pulling their weight in the expectations game.
**If you're going to have a QB as inexperienced as Jackson, it certainly would be nice to have at least one quality receiver to help bail him out. Bobby Wade came to Minnesota with the stats of a journeyman and has demonstrated a journeyman's skill set thus far. On a quality team he'd be your third receiver, at best, someone you threw in the slot on passing downs. Troy Williamson dropped two more passes today and is either physically or mentally incapable of overcoming this glaring flaw enough to gamble on his great speed. Sidney Rice looked good in the preseason, and made a good block on the screen pass versus Atlanta that helped spring Peterson for six. Don't know if Rice was injured or if Childress just decided to ride Robert Ferguson, but if this is indeed a rebuilding year (and only the most deluded fan would conclude otherwise), why not let Jackson and Rice get to know each other under game conditions as often as possible? Ferguson is obviously on the back end of his career. In any event, Wade-Williamson-Ferguson isn't going to stretch the field or otherwise scare anybody, especially with Jackson under center.
**It really is a shame that the line of scrimmage in a football game is one of the toughest places to really spotlight and appreciate a great defender. A good case can be made that Kevin Williams and Pat Williams are the best interior line tandem in the NFL right now, and when Kevin Williams breaks through and forces a fumble, as happened today, it reinforces the point. But most of the time teams don't even bother to run at the Williams boys--the Lions certainly didn't much today, and if the Falcons had anyone other than Joey Harrington they probably wouldn't have either--and when they do, it is just a rugby-like scrum most of the time. Kevin Williams is a better Keith Millard, and that's saying something because Millard, while being a crazy, 'roided MF, had some fabulous games in the pit. But the Vikes have never had a run-stuffer as good as Pat Williams was last season. Teams that live and die by the run, like the Bears, are going to be the most enjoyable opponents for the Vikings this season; although Chicago will probably even turn Rex Grossman loose against this pass defense.
**Which brings us to Cedric Griffin. I don't know the coverages, so I don't know if the Lions were picking on Griffin as much as it seemed today. But you certainly didn't see them completing much on Antonio Winfield. Griffin was one of my favorite players last year because he was upbeat and played with a no-nonsense attitude. But you can't teach height, and one of the few smart observations by today's commentators made the point about the physical disparity between Griffin and Lions receiver Roy Williams, not to mention the huge rookie Calvin Johnson. The Vikings' third round pick out of Fresno didn't have a great day either; ditto the linebackers in pass pro. Put it this way: The Vikes haven't come close to facing a quality quarterback yet, and already their secondary has been exposed. Hats off to Darren Sharper for two picks and heady forced fumble, and, to be fair, the defense has played well enough to be competitive both weeks thus far. But with the lack of offensive firepower, that back seven can't be as inconsistent as they've shown.
**Will we be looking at Kelly Holcomb before too long? Of all three signal-callers on the roster, he's the one with the most experience and the best credentials. Is Childress really prepared to go with Jackson through thick and thin? If so, tickets at the Dome are going to be fairly easy to come by around Thanksgiving.


After watching Mewelde drop two passes on the last drive, I'm inclined to agree with those hating on Childress today for having Peterson on the sidelines.
On the other hand, AP is a rookie, apparently isn't a strong pass blocker and cost his team the lead earlier with a fumble ... so I'm not that upset about it.
The Vikings simply are not a good team. I'll watch every week, but I can't bring myself to get upset when they lose. They deserve to lose.
While I'm here at the Vikings thread I might as well make a comment on yesterday's game with the Chiefs.
Down by three and on the final drive in the 4th qtr and Peterson is not on the field, but stands on the sidelines next to Childress instead. Huh-huh, Brad, You the Man!
I'm willing to let Foye learn the PG position. There's definitely a learning curve and I wish Foye had a veteran or coach to Mentor him through his development. I believe he has the talent to play PG in the NBA and he showed flashes of ability last year during the fourth qtr. Giving Foye the starting role and letting him sink or swim with a young team with low expectations will certainly provide ample opportunity for Foye to learn and grow into a point guard at the NBA level. I don't think PG is the position that needs to be addressed right now. What needs to be addressed now with the wolves is determining who amongst their bloated roster is worth the investment to develop into players alongside of Jefferson, Brewer and Foye over the upcoming years.
AK, whom I agree would be a longshot of ever coming to the Wolves (but not because the Wolves would not want him but rather because the Jazz would probably never send him here - within their division - and if they would, AK still might prefer going to a contending team or back to the motherland), would provide the veteran leadership to grow the core three players around while keeping the Wolves as competitive as they were the last couple of years with KG anchoring the lineup.
I can't see why the Jazz would want our junk. I doubt Davis has the personality to fit the Jazz system and I know Blount doesn't have the personality or the game.
And this is only from their perspective. The wolves made the decision to have a bad team to save money (which we somehow refer to as "cap flexibility". The Clippers spent years maintaining cap flexibility). This is not an environment that would pick up AKs contract. I think what they're trying to do is copy the twins. Unfortunately, our drafts are good, but not great players.
In fact, when I think of the wolves, I only wonder if they'll take Mayo (who would like Minnie the same way Marbury did) or Rose. And then there's that greek center (who I keep thinking his name is Kofta(food) or Kofka(writer)... but it's not). All in all some intrigue. But we'll probably take another shooting guard/small forward.
Are the t-wolves really going to go into the next year with their PG situation? We can talk about AK, but he worked when we had KG distributing the ball. Shouldn't a PG be our highest priority? Foye showed nothing that made me think he's anything but a 2.
But, the worst thing about not having anyone who can distribute the ball (besides Davis, who everyone wants to trade) is that the basketball will be painful to watch, just like the old days.
If we did manage to get AK, I think our frontline would be Brewer, Jefferson, AK. Slide Jefferson to the five and play AK at the 4. Blount could spell Jefferson for 10-20 minutes a game.
AK's contract is huge, but hes much younger than KG. His contract is not nearly as risky as the smaller ones for mediocre players like Blount and Jaric. As long as AK is healthy, I'm sure we would get our moneys worth and Target center is much more likely to fill up again sooner rather than later. If [and its probably a big if] the wolves can get this deal done, I think they would be smart to do it.
I think we'd all love to see AK here, but his deal would immediately put us back in the bad contracts situation that we just partially alleviated by dumping The Best Player on the Planet. I absolutely love AK's game though...surprisingly (and unfortunately for us and Utah), he's really best suited for the PF role over the SF - and we're not going to unload Jefferson, the player McHale has coveted from day one. On top of that, we've already got SF/PF tweeners in Smith and Gomes...Boozer is clicking with Deron Williams, so Utah would have no interest in AJ.
For a trade to be acceptable to the Wolves, I'd have to say Marko + Blount + a first-rounder (or MAYBE Foye). I'd definitely be happy with that deal, but I can't see it from Utah's perspective, unless we include Randy. Today's hot rumor is that AK is willing to walk away from the deal if the Jazz are...we'll see about that...
Britt, I don't think there's any topic that can go for a week without turning into a Wolves thread!
Howard + Jaric sounds like the best deal for both teams, and that could get it done.
We have to dump at least one bad contract on them (Jaric) and I'd prefer to keep Ricky's expiring.
Agree, Sloan taking Blount is a pipe dream.
Let's not forget AK was thought to be a top 20 player before last season. He's still young. His contract is too big, but it is not awful, especially if he returns to form.
I agree that the Wolves should not use Ratliff's contract in a potential deal. Utah is not that bad off from a cap perspective, so it's probably not necessary.
Howard + Davis for AK gets it done from a cap standpoint, but it would tie up the Wolves' overall salary cap again awfully quickly.
Howard+Jaric would work for cap purposes also and give the Wolves a little more long-term flexibility without totally killing Utah's cap.
I have no idea what Utah might want, but I really can't imagine Jerry Sloan OKing a deal that brings him Mark Blount, so that's probably wishful thinking on our parts...
Andy,
You beat me to the punch, and with an interesting topic to boot. Our crummy package for AK wouldn't seem to be all that appealing to Utah, but it sounds like AK is basically forcing a trade.
The forced trade, plus his monster contract, all but assures Utah is not going to get anything close to fair value talent-wise. So who knows? Maybe there's a chance.
I'd rule out Ratliff's expiring contract- that would be a gift. But Ricky's expiring plus a few of our own bad contracts (Jaric and Blount would be awesome) would seem like a reasonable offer. Juwan Howard could be the clincher for Utah.
So, Wolves training camp opens next week....
Any chance we can get a blog going?
other possibilities include
Theo Ratliff straight up for Kirilenko or Davis/Maddog/hassel for him.
We have a surplus of players and there are several combinations. I say we just tell Utah to take their pick from our roster excluding Foye, JEfferson and Brewer and we don't give away a future 1st round draft choice. The question is can Utah get a better deal somewhere else and I would venture to guess the answer is probably.
VIkings...Shmikings...
Who cares? When is wolves Training camp? Oden is out for the year and Andrei Kirilenko wants out of Utah. All right, we talked about this last spring as a possible addition to place alongside of KG. All I can say is I hope McHale is talking to Utah and proposing that we send Ricky Davis and Marko or Blount to them for Andrei. I don't know if Utah could do better or not, but its worth a shot.
Having kirilenko be the veteran star for a couple years helping along the young careers of Foye, Jefferson and Brewer would put fans in the seats this year and allow the Wolves to compete to possibly compete for a lower seed playoff spot. Is it a possibility?
It wasn't just Leftwich...there were a number of quarterbacks available, but Childress decided to tie his future to T Jack. This could be a disaster for the Vikings and his first coaching job.
It's also apparent that Jackson has nowhere near the tools of Culpepper. This doesn't mean he can't develop into a good or great player... but it's so early in his development that we don't have any evidence to say he's more than a complete bust.
This year, I think we'll run the the "B" version of Jeff George taking over for Randall Cunningham; but with T Jack playing Randall and Holcomb playing Jeff George.
...or maybe that's the "C" version.
I don't think Tarvaris has the dominating physical tools that Daunte had, which allowed one to still be excited for his potential even though his debut was pretty lousy. I've always had the feeling Jackson has the talent of a career backup and nothing more.
Why didn't the team jump at the chance to get Byron Leftwich when he was available? He is injury prone but I always thought he was pretty effective in Jacksonville, and his teammates supposedly loved him.
Flandango--
I didn't take it as you calling me out, just pointing something out you thought was at odds with what I wrote. And I understand your sympathy for Jackson--it certainly isn't his fault he's not ready, and after coming right out and saying he wasn't ready before his first start last season, and the blowback he got, he won't do anything but keep a stiff upper lip and try and do what they say this year. Even if that means not running when he's open because they want to develop his other skills.
Yeah, wasn't trying to call you out and pretend I'm smarter than everyone but I guess that's what I did. It does seem like TJ keeps starting to run when the field is wide-open only to throw a short pass to a covered reciever that is either dropped or ends with the guy being tackled immediately. I also blame Childress for throwing TJ to the wolves this early; I feel a little bad for the QB, he's obviously trying but it's just not working for him. I'd actually go ahead and start Bollinger for the next couple weeks, mainly because I can't think of a good answer to "Why the hell not?" I don't think that a man named Kelly is going to take us anywhere, and the ball was moving before Brooks dropped it (though you could go ahead and blame Birk for that one as well - only the two of them know the real culprit).
Flandango--
What I meant was the ball wasn't tipped at the line of scrimmage or otherwise altered from afar in a way that prevented it from going where it was aimed. The first interception was tipped alright; by one of the three guys surrounding the primary receiver, on a pass thrown by Jackson across his body into the middle of the field--on third and 2, nio less, when he might have had the corner if he'd tucked and run.
I noted the failure of the line and the receivers. But not to designate Jackson as the top goat of this loss is just silly. You can blame Childress and company for throwing him into a situation in which he is plainly overmatched--and I do. But that doesn't take away from the ugliness of the spectacle--indeed, it makes it uglier.
But yes, I agree with almost all your other assessments, and do believe one of the all-time great tackle tandems is indeed being wasted.
First of all, the first interception definately was tipped; still a dumb pass, but tipped. Second, the problem is the entire Vikes offense, not just Jackson. The line is living off their individual reputations, the recievers are all no-names and the starting running back is hurt. AP will be too if CT can't get back to spell him, or if MM isn't used more. Bad drafting (Cook, WIlliamson, Jackson, etc.), bad free-agents (Shiancoe, Wade, Fergeson) and age (Birk) are killing them. Maybe T Jax would have a chance with even one competent reciever, or if he wasn't flushed from the pocket every play. I fear that we're going to waste our awesome defense in the same way we wasted our awesome offenses of the past.
CSE makes a good point about receivers. If I remember right Chris Carter had Tommy Kramer, Wade Wilson, Rich Gannon, Jim McMahon, Sean Salisbury, Warren Moon, Brad Johnson, Randall Cunningham and Duante as his quarterbacks during his career. His Peer from the 49ers, Jerry Rice, had two - Steve Young and Joe Montana. Carter made all of his quarterbacks look better than they were. Of course there are still many intangibles, including who was lined up on the other side of the field, the offensive lines, offensive coaching etc.
I still agree that quarterbacks are extremely critical to the success of the team, but you got to wonder about the help Jackson is getting as well.
Good receivers with the Vikings go back to my childhood as well preceding Anthony Carter. Gene Washington, John Gilliam, Ahmed Rashad and Sammy White were great Vikings receivers in the past as well.
It is hard to get excited about a defensive oriented vikings team in the Metrodome. My advice to Childress and the offensive coaches is to forget about the pass and trying to outthink the opposing teams defense. Run the damn ball - every play.
Anything better than 6 wins for the Vikings this year would be overachieving, in my opinion. But I do think there will be a lot of close, fun-to-watch games.
Using the Daunte Culpepper correlary, I'm willing to cut Tavaris Jackson some slack. Anyone else remember how bad Daunte was in his first (albeit limited) action during his first couple years in the league? And then he became the starter and was damn near MVP-like for a couple years before the wheels came off. Anyway, Jackson probably will spend much more time playing like Daunte at his worst and not Daunte at his best ... but I'm taking a wait-and-see approach, if for no other reason than:
The Vikings have a terrible (bottom 3 in the league, if not dead last) receiving corps. Britt was spot-on that the team's top receiver would be the third best receiver (or worse) on most NFL teams. I felt the same way last year season. Even as weak as the Vikes are at QB, I think the team's biggest problem is WR. It's strange because as far back as I can remember, the Vikes have had quality WRs. I grew up in the Anthony Carter, Hassan Jones, Leo Lewis era. The Cris Carter/Jake Reed/Randy Moss days are still fresh in Vikings fans' collective memory.
Point being, good WRs can make a decent QB look good and a bad QB look decent. Just ask Jon Kitna and J.T. O'Sullivan.
I'm sick and tired of Birk and Hutchinson resting on their laurels. Over the past season and two games no two Vikes have performed further beneath expectations than these FORMER All- Pros.
They are both fat and happy with oversized contracts, endorsements (Hutchinson) and business ventures (Birk). Moving the chains has become secondary for these guys and it shows on Sundays.
A bad quarterback would have won the game for the Vikings yesterday, but unfortunately, ours is terrible.
I am not even seeing flashes of promise from Jackson. He doesn't even seem to have back-up potential.
Could be a really long season if Holcomb doesn't get the call soon.
I agree on all fronts. I wish I knew why the staff was so down on Mewelde, other than being injury prone, he has always been able to contribute. Also, if the Viks need to find a way to get their wideouts involved in space and on quick routes...Jermaine Wiggins should would be nice to have around about now....